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I need serious help with a Pro Flo

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  • I need serious help with a Pro Flo

    I have a 68 Charger in the shop, with a gen 1 ProFlo. It's a 440 engine, comp cam 484 lift/284 duration. Running stock manifolds and dual exhaust, auto trans. The entire kit was installed many years ago, the car not driven more than 2000 miles since rebuilt in 2004. I tuned this once back in 07, and back then - it had issues seeming to retain memory (saving programs to "A", etc.). I can barely get the car to run, much less get out of its own way, and forget about driving uphill. Sometimes, you can turn it off, restart the engine and if you immediately hit the accelerator, it will run pretty good - for about 10-15 seconds, then it falls on its face. The base timing was checked with the cal module set in base timing mode, it's at 10 degrees BTDC. Fuel pressure is about 40 PSI, though I did notice the pump seems loud. Having not seen the car in several years, I cannot remember if that was normal, but I think it was always loud. Anyways, the calibrations never seem to save properly, for long periods of time. Reloading the base program doesn't seem to help. I also need help trying to setup the spark and fuel maps. I can work around them not staying in memory for prolonged time; if I can at least get something that works written down. I have tried following the owners manual for tuning with the cal module, but it seems the best way is with a dyno and a means of watching the air/fuel ratio. I have no access to a dyno, and the cal module doesn't show the air/fuel ratio anywhere.

  • #2
    I wonder if the ECU has a backup battery that's expired?

    As for tuning. You really need a wideband display, with data logger to tune it properly.
    At 43,861 MPH Elon Musk now owns the fastest car in this Galaxy

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    • #3
      In part, this is what I suspect. My hypothesis is based on the wiring to the system ( and lack of "keep alive" hard wire circuit ). There is apparently one wire to provide power to the system, and it goes to ignition switched "on/run" power supply (and it does need to be wired that way, as a direct voltage feed would certainly kill the battery quickly). On many vehicles, a keep alive circuit is run direct to the battery, with its sole purpose being to keep the memory alive in the ECU, so the controller "remembers" how to run the engine. My initial thoughts, since there is no separate keep alive wire, that perhaps capacitors were being used to store a voltage supply, that would be slowly consumed, and recharged with normal use of the vehicle. Since this vehicle sees prolonged storage, I was thinking that is how the memory keeps getting lost. Interesting that you brought up a battery, as that would make total sense, as well. I've not seen any documentation regarding such battery, but then, it may not have been designed to be replaced by the average consumer. If it exists, I may be able to do that; but time is really of the essence on this project - I have a very tight deadline closing in. You are right about a wide band O2 and data logger, however - this system was initially designed to be tuned somehow without them. The programmed chip sent by Edelbrock after they receive engine build info, I would have thought would get the car to run pretty decent on its own; requiring only fine tuning for perfection with the cal module. In this case, that could not be further from reality than me piloting Elon Musk's car into orbit. I suspect the chip and/or ECU are at fault in this case. I found it interesting that an internet search of this system being used by Mopar 440 owners, has yielded more than what I would think is a normal amount of people complaining about it in general. I'm not bashing on it, just stating some similar results. You can never tell who is behind the installs, and whether or not every step was followed, so I certainly consider that. The owner and I would certainly like to upgrade to the ProFlo 4's controller and interface; yet have been told the entire system is different. I'm not so sure about that, as it appears the fuel rail, intake, distributor, and fuel delivery requirements "seem" to all be the same, based on pictures I've seen. If it's just a harness, ECU and interface (taking the place of the cal module) that is different, we would have no issue purchasing the required components and giving it a go.

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      • #4
        Lot's of devices use a very small backup battery...GPS Antennas, laptops, Edelbrocks Data loggers, etc..

        They are generally soldered to the circuit.

        I'm currently drawing out a diagram to convert Pro-Flo "XT" systems to the Pro-Flo 4 ECU.
        So the main hurdle converting the "Original" Pro-FLo system to a Pro-Flo 4 is all the sensors, and how the injectors are wired. It's just must easier, and cheaper to install the whole Pro-Flo 4 system, the then to do a upgrade.
        At 43,861 MPH Elon Musk now owns the fastest car in this Galaxy

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        • #5
          Second picture down. The redish device at the lower left side of the ECU.....It looks like a battery.

          http://sonic.net/~mikebr/efi/ecu_hdwr.html
          At 43,861 MPH Elon Musk now owns the fastest car in this Galaxy

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          • #6
            Only Qwikdata 2 and Pro Flo XT Plus ECU's use a backup battery. All other Pro Flo ECU's do not have a battery.

            In reviewing the symptoms above, it sounds like clogged fuel injectors. You state that the car has not run in a couple years. When injectors sit with gas in them, the gas evaporates and leaves a varnish behind that restricts flow. The comment that it runs close to OK right after startup fits as well because during a cold start the ECU adds a lot of extra fuel that is quickly removed over about 15 seconds. Your fuel pressure is in the ball park. I would pull the injectors and send them out for cleaning or replace them. Adding a bottle of injector cleaner will not have much effect.

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            • #7
              Thanks Steve, while I do suspect the fuel system is restricted; I think that is only half the battle, considering the constant programming and memory loss.

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              • #8
                Support from Edelbrock for Pro-Flo 1 has essentially ended. Save yourself lots of time and frustration and upgrade to Pro-Flo 4. Call in and speak to our EFI tech for more info - be sure to reference this thread.

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                • #9
                  Thank you for your help, guys. We have decided to replace the Pro Flo with a new system.

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                  • #10
                    I am having similar issues but it is running ok, its really rich on the idle low end but runs fine at 1500 or higher rpm, Fuel rail pressure is 45lbs and cals seem to be remembered by the ecm. even after long storage times. the idle is rough and very rich. My biggest problem is I am losing Voltage at hot starts on the Pink/Black wire. Learning about tuning is going pretty good as I do have an a/f on the car and a buddy can make adjustments through the driving ranges. I would love to upgrade the system however, $$ are an issue at this point. 73 Challenger/440/727 GV overdrive

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